Dev Meeting Transcript (July 2, 2021)

[4:01 PM] Kent Bull: Hello!

[4:03 PM] Kent Bull: Meeting at 2:00 PM MST?

[4:08 PM] parole895: Hi

[4:08 PM] kralverde: Hello

[4:09 PM] kralverde: Not sure if its on the hour or half-past…

[4:10 PM] Kent Bull: It used to be on the hour. Things may have changed since I was last at a meeting on 4/16/21

[4:11 PM] kralverde: Since none of the core devs are here yet, im gonna assume half-past

[4:11 PM] Kent Bull: Seems reasonable.

[4:29 PM] HyperPeek: I think it actually is on the hour… Anyway.

[4:29 PM] kralverde: Anyway

[4:30 PM] kralverde: Lets get this party started

[4:31 PM] kralverde: For an update on ledger devices: a pr for full asset support has been sent in, so we just need to wait for a response

[4:32 PM] kralverde: Community projects can be added to ravencoin.org now so we need to spread the word about that

[4:32 PM] kralverde: And my asset shake-down is almost ready to get put out

[4:33 PM] kralverde: Thats all i have

[4:34 PM] HyperPeek: Yeah — its great progress on Electrum thanks to kralverde — Full asset support is close.

[4:34 PM] Deadheded: Scotty has been working hard on a browser wallet and hope to be live soon

[4:34 PM] Kent Bull: Nice work kralverde

[4:35 PM] Deadheded: "been receiving JSON data from Rikki for various NFTs you've probably seen rendered better now on the asset explorer. I'm also working on some caching and indexing functionality that's needed especially by the mobile wallet but will be useful for much more."

[4:35 PM] HyperPeek: Ohh thats cool news, did not know!

[4:35 PM] Kent Bull: No news from me. I'm just conducting an analysis of Ravencoin's voting features and plans.

[4:35 PM] Ben: my turn :slight_smile:

I've submitted the PR to add swap execution to core wallet, and i'm currently working on adding swap execution to electrum.

creation has some discussion around it (and core functionality needed in electrum to support)

[4:36 PM] kralverde: Really just the single|anyonecanpay

[4:36 PM] Kent Bull: Cool. Which PR Ben ? I'll give it a review. Same with yours, kralverde . Reviewing PRs is a great way for me to re-involve myself and learn about your work.

[4:37 PM] kralverde: The electrum work is seperate from the core wallet

[4:37 PM] Ben: https://github.com/RavenProject/Ravencoin/pull/1083

[4:38 PM] Deadheded: new NFT json format viewer https://ravencoin.asset-explorer.net/a/RVNFT%23ZEBRATIF_RVN_O_CLOCK

[4:39 PM] Kent Bull: Will you send me the link to the electrum repo? Or, where should I find it on ravencoin.org if I can?

[4:39 PM] Kent Bull: Is it this? https://github.com/Electrum-RVN-SIG/electrumx-ravencoin

[4:39 PM] kralverde: Thats the server

[4:39 PM] HyperPeek: I think there is pretty much consensus about adding fullfilment of swaps in core, as that is really straight forward. Creating them is more tricky and especially the advertisement needs discussion.

[4:39 PM] kralverde: https://github.com/Electrum-RVN-SIG/electrum-ravencoin here is the client

[4:40 PM] Deadheded: Kent Bullhttps://kralverde.github.io/assets/

[4:40 PM] kralverde: I personally think swap databases and the like should be kept out of the core

[4:41 PM] kralverde: It should be a “second layer”

[4:41 PM] Ben: agreed, i opened a topic for discussion of the creation side. and seconded on the swap db, that discussion should come after and seperate

[4:41 PM] Ben: (unless we end up going with some P2P broadcast mechanism, but that is way down the line)

[4:42 PM] HyperPeek: Yeah — its great in any case — just need to figure how :slight_smile:

[4:42 PM] push: hey all. my hearty congratulations on Ben's hard work on the Dex. a fine bit of engineering the lists and serverclient is. its a perfect example of what the future really holds for the corrupt securities market. the power of ravencoin is strong. the beast of wallstreet is scared of things like this. keep up the hard work and I look forward to seeing many great futuristic developments in this nascent securities industry. it is just the beginning, of course

[4:44 PM] Kent Bull: Is that all for this week? We could have a short meeting today due to holidays.

[4:46 PM] HyperPeek: Maybe quick update on QT — its also close to release. Waiting for signing keys for Apple / Windows and final word on p2sh audit.

[4:47 PM] kralverde: And double checking assets with p2sh 😉

[4:48 PM] Rikki RATTOE – RVNFT.art: How do I get RVNFT added to that?

[4:48 PM] HyperPeek: I think the only missing part is HTLC and Hans was looking into that.

[4:49 PM] kralverde: You would pr your info into https://github.com/RavenProject/ravenproject.github.io/blob/master/_data/projects.yml

[4:49 PM] Kent Bull: Also, now that we have SIGs up and running with their own meeting rhythms it would make sense this meeting would have less pressure and be more high level. How have the SIGs been going?

[4:50 PM] Kent Bull: I’ve been in another world since April. Nice to be back here.

[4:50 PM] Ben: yup, thats the part im interested in. Hans_Schmidt I would be willing to help test too if needed

[4:50 PM] kralverde: Electrum is almost ready for a release for creating and reissuing the big three assets (though no hardware yet), im just working through the submitted bugs rn

[4:50 PM] kralverde: The new mobile wallet decided to write it up from scratch

[4:51 PM] kralverde: They dont have weekly meetings afaik

[4:51 PM] push: Some people including kinkajou mentioned to me that there was some talk of oracles and covenants being added to RVN. Is there a link to any talk of this on github or suggestions being made how that would be hypothetically done? not sure if it was a serious consideration or not but wanted to ask about it.

[4:52 PM] HyperPeek: Yeah Hans brought that idea up — its still very early stage, but might be a way forward instead of full segwit support etc.

[4:53 PM] HyperPeek: It seems more doable and confined in terms of consensus touching code and testing

[4:53 PM] push: A hybrid solution is an interesting compromise if both parties are satisfied with the features it would provide. the question is whether full segwitters would be satisfied, one presupposes

[4:53 PM] kinkajou: SegWit brings scalability benefits as well which will be needed in the long run especially if covenants bring increased adoption.

[4:53 PM] Kent Bull: That’s interesting, an alternative to Segwit. First I’ve heard of that.

[4:53 PM] push: here we go

[4:53 PM] push: 🙂

[4:53 PM] push: :PES_CowboyLove: kinkajou

[4:54 PM] Kent Bull: I’m bouncing. It’s been good chatting with you all! Chat with you next week.

[4:54 PM] push: im pro either or both. its a good discussion. it should be mentioned

[4:54 PM] push: thanks all :thumbsup:

[4:54 PM] kinkajou: Idk why we would be against a time-tested solution that has numerous benefits and is additionally necessary to interface with much of the Bitcoin ecosystem.

[4:55 PM] kinkajou: Wasn't that the whole point of building off the Bitcoin codebase?

[4:55 PM] Deadheded: Benchownuk — 06/16/2021

Deadheded Sounds good. In the future when its gone into a fully released functionality we could possibly offer Ben a Development Fund bounty if he is able to open source it to RITO.

[4:58 PM] HyperPeek: Nothing against it, its just the amount of consensus code that will have to be added and extended to assets means several month implementation and testing. Thats why Hans looked into more straight forward solutions first that could achieve functionality that RVN really could benefit.

[5:01 PM] kralverde: thank you all, happy fourth to those celebrating

[5:02 PM] kinkajou: We would still need SegWit though. And it seems to me like covenants would require as much if not more testing in addition to more research since there isn't nearly as much info out there on them. Wouldn't we then just have to redo convenants when adding SegWit later on if we're specifically choosing a solution that doesn't utilize SegWit?

[5:03 PM] Deadheded: I didn't mention that Scotty is also working on RVNDB which is a database that can be updated via RVN transaction and change the IPFS data tied to an asset

[5:03 PM] kinkajou: I've been bringing up SegWit for multiple months now and even offered to fund development earlier in the year but keep getting told "it will take too long" or "we need to look at other stuff first". Seems like with all the time spent delaying SegWit it could've been coded and in testing by now.

[5:05 PM] kralverde: I would say the main focus is on p2sh right now

[5:05 PM] kralverde: Just finalizing and getting it out

[5:05 PM] kralverde: Once that is done, anything is fair game as the next step.

[5:06 PM] HyperPeek: Yes — the problem with segwit is assets — segwit for rvn can be copied more or less from btc but all asset stuff has to be written from scratch. And with p2sh that looked easy but turned out to be a multi-month testing in the end.

[5:07 PM] kinkajou: It may be a bit more difficult than implementing it on bitcoin or just for our native currency but the reason we need it so much more is because of assets. We have the capacity for millions times more currencies to be transacting on the same rails as Bitcoin.

[5:09 PM] kinkajou: I suspect we will eventually need some sort of L2 "lightning network-like" solution for assets as well if we see the kind of adoption many of us hope for so not planning for that ahead of time when we've seen what high tx fees and full blocks did to ETH seems foolish IMO

[5:09 PM] HyperPeek: I totally agree, but its simply about going forward step-by-step and making sure the mainnet is secured.

[5:13 PM] ChiefofStonks: I read that once P2SH and HTLC are released, it would increase the possibility of something like RSK for solidity smart contract integration on the RVN blockchain. Is this true, is it on the roadmap, if so how long out would something like this take to add roughly? https://twitter.com/Ravencoin/status/1004905624721854464

[5:14 PM] HyperPeek: P2SH is working on development and tested on tesnet — should be only weeks. HTLC is to believed working already with our p2sh implementation, but not yet confirmed.

[5:59 PM] Hans_Schmidt: Sorry I couldn't join earlier and need to jump off again. But I want to clarify one thing- the research going on to possibly implement support for Covenants and Oracles on Ravencoin is not a replacement for segwit. Segwit will still be needed eventually for scaleability and to remove transaction malleability. The Covenant & Oracle work is to bring on support for some types of smart contracts like futures contracts and options without the complexity or security compromises of a full smart contract language. Initial indications are that Covenants/Oracles may be much less coding work than segwit, which is the only reason it may make sense it do that first and provide a defi capability boost to Ravencoin. kinkajou

[6:00 PM] kinkajou: Awesome, thanks for clearing that up Hans_Schmidt !